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#89440: "Map 4: Players should be able to sell a card just before donating"

fixed: Feilen har blitt fikset

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Ark Nova #380072751

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May 25 th 2023 11:20 • kwas85 • Feilen har ikke blitt reprodusert av utviklerne enda:

May 25 th 2023 11:30 • sqreek • Feilen har ikke blitt reprodusert av utviklerne enda:

I think issue here is that after reputation was added, and card was gain, there is no check for available actions.
Meaning, because all checks shows that there is no possible Action ( no money for nature support) it automaticly end association actions and gives possibility to sell card then(which is after association task)

rules says that you can sell this at any moment.

So developers need to add this specific Action (only applied for this map) to
possible actions to check before auto move to the next step.

(I hope I help, not adding information noise)

May 25 th 2023 12:07 • Tisaac • Utviklerne ønsker mer informasjon for å kunne reprodusere denne programfeilen:

Hum. Might be a legit timing issue indeed.

May 25 th 2023 12:45 • kwas85 • Utviklerne ønsker mer informasjon for å kunne reprodusere denne programfeilen:

As sqreek describe:
"rules says that you can sell this at any moment"

So it can be taken when action is taking place. And bonus for map looks like is possible to be taken before and after action only.

May 25 th 2023 12:52 • Tisaac • Utviklerne ønsker mer informasjon for å kunne reprodusere denne programfeilen:

" So it can be taken when action is taking place. And bonus for map looks like is possible to be taken before and after action only." => nope, that's not true.
sqreek analysis is closer to the truth: the engine can skip automatically some undoable actions and proceed to the next one to avoid avoid to click "pass" a lot.

May 25 th 2023 14:40 • kwas85 • Utviklerne ønsker mer informasjon for å kunne reprodusere denne programfeilen:

Ok but sell card button is only shown before action card is selected and after all events of action are finished.
What is not correct do to rule "at any moment"

May 25 th 2023 14:50 • GTSchemer • Utviklerne ønsker mer informasjon for å kunne reprodusere denne programfeilen:

One thing that has to carefully avoided is selling in the middle of drawing cards -- I could triple check but I am pretty sure the publisher told us this should not be allowed.

The described case sounds possible though.

May 25 th 2023 14:56 • kwas85 • Utviklerne ønsker mer informasjon for å kunne reprodusere denne programfeilen:

But selling during draft is Ok for this rule. Rule is saying that you can do it at any moment but once in turn.
And because of it exploit of playing card on strength 1 when you have no card is possible.
I mean scenario:
Number of cards: 0
Action card strength: 1(1 draw 1 discard)
During draft you selling card and then you have none to discard.

May 25 th 2023 16:12 • GTSchemer • Utviklerne ønsker mer informasjon for å kunne reprodusere denne programfeilen:

I understand the argument, but the official Ark Nova publisher/designer/editor sources have communicated it's not the intent.

You are not supposed to be able to game the system with (for example) a hand of 0 cards, and doing Cards I strength 1 to draw 1, discard 1...but sell the card before you are forced to discard it.

This is a candidate for a future official FAQ update, for sure.

May 25 th 2023 16:44 • kwas85 • Utviklerne ønsker mer informasjon for å kunne reprodusere denne programfeilen:

So current state would be to clarify described scenarios with publisher/designer/editor?
This ticket would be left as tracker for it? And propably never resolved?

May 25 th 2023 16:57 • GTSchemer • Feil har blitt bekreftet av utviklerne:

I asked the rules editor today, and he confirmed it should be legal to gain a card during the association action, then sell it before doing a donation.

May 25 th 2023 17:16 • sqreek • Feil har blitt bekreftet av utviklerne:

First, passing a sorry in the kwas name for
"This ticket would be left as tracker for it? And propably never resolved?"
I read it as a passive aggresive, but it was not his intention here (just talked with him about it, but he cannot reply atm)

Second about test case that could be also affected not only this map, however it should works

Consider money less than free association action cost ( let say 6 where 7 is needed as in described case)

I use bonus from support conversion project to
a) gain money ( this probably works, as I think I had this situation)
b) gain 2 size entrance and cover bonus on map that gives money (did not have that situation)

May 25 th 2023 17:38 • GTSchemer • Feil har blitt bekreftet av utviklerne:

@sqreek I believe that already works. The only missing case seems to be allowing a player to sell a card just before donating.

May 25 th 2023 17:39 • GTSchemer • Feil har blitt bekreftet av utviklerne:

Report short description
"Map 4: selling card during association action do not enable nature support (0 cost action)"
changed to
"Map 4: Players should be able to sell a card just before donating"

Jun 20 th 2023 00:21 • Tisaac • Feilen har blitt fikset:

Fixed.

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#89440: "Map 4: Players should be able to sell a card just before donating"

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